Scales & Ales Podcast

More Liquor Laws with Attorney Adam Marshall: Inducements & Law History | Tulsa Podcast

by | Mar 30, 2019 | Beer, Scales & Ales Podcast



Marshall Morris: On this episode of Scales and Ales. We talk music, business and beer with Adam Marshall who talks about the new liquor laws and inducements. Here we go.

Eric Chupp: Marshall, bring us in.

Marshall Morris: Well, welcome back to the Snug. We just cheers and uh, we’re back on the snugcast drinking beer.

Eric Chupp: Loose version

Marshall Morris: It’s the game cast

Eric Chupp: It’s the casual Friday GameCast out of this Snug.

Marshall Morris: So if you ever want to check it out, you come out to the snug and we’re playing games.

Adam Marshall: I had a number of, uh, of guests on. Um, and now we’re just kind of reflecting a little bit, so we’re going to go in the year seeing what’s happening out there. Uh, what’s up?

Eric Chupp: What is new this new year with any a new alcohol laws started? Anything Start January one, 2019.

Adam Marshall: You know, it all started October one, and so there’s nothing new, but we will get the legislature going into session at the end of the month and there will probably be some cleanup items. And I think some of the things we’ve talked about on some prior podcasts when we talked with, talked about Marshall Brewing with then we also talked with, with Mike Thornbrugh from QuikTrip. Uh, and if, uh, if you, if nobody’s listening to that when it was a great, great interview Mike Thornbrugh has a lot of history.

Adam Marshall: He’s or government affairs. W We got to know each other quite a bit through that whole process. Now what I see is fixing stuff. We really didn’t know what was broken because all this stuff got passed in 20, uh, in the 2016 legislative session. It had a two year phase in. Now after 2016, we still had to have a vote. That was in November of 2016 to amend the constitution to allow for all these laws to come in. So October hits and that’s when a lot of the retail, I’m talking bars, restaurants, and then a liquor stores start to kind of go, okay, this is not working right. Because distribution system has totally changed. And so you look at little things like, like with bars and restaurants and um, what, what they’re dealing with are some little nuances like, uh, no buckets of beer because before three-two beer, it was regulated by food.

Adam Marshall: It was called low point beer. It was three-two by four point of why we I’m regulated by food and are regulated like food and wasn’t really even considered alcohol under the ABLE definition of alcohol. So you could go sell six beers in a bucket to one person, uh, that were opened at a bar. Uh, whereas anything that’s strong beer and above being wine, spirits, beer that’s above 4% ABV, which is again three-two ABW. Um, you, you have a two drink tutoring limit her per person now. And it could be, you could give, you could serve somebody two Marshall. This Land Lagers, I have to throw that out there. You could serve somebody two of those which arguably have, you know, a 5% alcohol in them. Five, 5.2 a premium strength blogger. But then you’ve also could serve somebody to long island ice teas, in each of those could have six ounces of liquor. And you know, so there’s an interesting history behind this because there was an attempt long ago to kind of define what an individual drink was in the restaurant association. Uh, yeah. On the restaurant association fought it and they won. And so then they were left with just two drinks. That’s it. Their grants, what’s a drink? There’s no definition of a drink, but there’s kind of a downside to defining it or

Marshall Morris: I’m going to a wall, I’m going to tee up a whole bunch of things that I’ve learned that either are, are allowed or not allowed. Okay. At bars and restaurants and I don’t know, we didn’t, we haven’t talked about this, about the things that I’m going to ask you. So I would say you can either dispel the myth. Okay. All right. You can set the record straight or you can say that’s way too complicated and be complicated to get into on that.

Eric Chupp: I know something that’s not allowed. You’re not allowed to break the shot glasses at bars. I learned that,

Adam Marshall: Yeah, you’re really not, that’s not an ABLE, that’s more of a disorderly conduct, you know, get out of my shop. So all right.

Marshall Morris: So here’s one, here’s one of them that maybe you can dispel the myth of is selling, I’m selling a a drink for less than a minimum price. Is there, is there a minimum price? Because what, what I understood is you couldn’t give away like a shot for free or something like that. But what you could do is you could do like a beer and a shot or you could do a combination of drinks for, for uh, for a certain specific dollar amount. Yeah, yeah.

Adam Marshall: Actually you cannot, okay. Now the first you had a few issues. So one of the first ones is that there is now in the law a floor on prices. You can’t sell any alcohol and package and at and for on premises. So right in the industry we talk about on premise and off premise consumption. So on premise consumption, pour you a pint of beer, open the beer, you’re going to consume it there. Right off premise is I’m gonna say a six pack, I’m gonna sell you clothes stuff and you can, you walk out the door. The growler growler is kind of a hybrid, but it’s considered mostly off premise. Right? Um, but, but both those channels now have a 6% floor, which means that they can’t sell any, any alcohol for 6% for any less than 6% above cost. So that’s one God, one, one requirement.

Adam Marshall: The second requirement when you get into other sorts of discounts is there supposed to be like zero inducements to stimulate consumption, if you will. And I think that’s the term the law uses. Uh, but, but it’s this notion of inducement. So package deals, if somebody doesn’t want the shot but only wants to be here, you better be able to sell them the beer for a certain price. So it make him feel like, even though that stuff goes on out there, it’s just a matter of enforcement and lack of knowledge. Because like one of the things that that was done, let’s say for example, in the three to channel, uh, at convenience stores would be okay. On the single beers, we’re talking Tom Ford route 23 to four ounces. All sorts of scientifically tallboys yeah, yeah. Topless would say one for a dollar 79. Um, two for three bucks.

Adam Marshall: That’s a less of a price than they would be individually. We can’t do that. And so when we had the changeover in the law, able went to several of these convenience store chains and said, you really can’t do that. One of the problems that was happening at the grocery store chains, because they’d never been regulated by Abel, is they’re putting together holiday baskets. You know, hey, get this. And what has to happen disc is you have to be able to sell somebody any piece of that, what’s in that basket. So if it’s got that, if it’s got that, that fake, you know, grass in there, like you get an Easter, it’s got, you know, squiggly paper, it’s got a basket. You better be able to sell that person. All those out. The alcohol. Yeah, the same price that it would be discounted as a package.

Adam Marshall: Yeah. So the alcohol can’t be discounted. So the alcohol got gotta be one price and then all those items have to be together. Because if you give something for free with an alcohol purchase, that’s an inducement doozy. Give something at a discounted price. So basically you have to take the whole package and set the alcohol that what the alcohol will be, but then set the price of the basket. And I had the price of the basket on the shelfs and if somebody says, hey, we want the basket, not everything else. I’ve got a basket. You’ve got to get us all in the basket. That’s crazy. Yeah,

Marshall Morris: I got the next one, I got the next one, the one that I’m curious about. And I think I feel like he’s solved all of these issues by just saying no inducements and so that it takes a little bit of the fund and he goes, a fight is what? The new, what’s the inducement? It’s a fine line. So the next one that I know this was the thing is, is that you can’t have daily specials at a bar because you have to extend that special to every day of the week or something wall. Uh, it’s an old law. So, so you know what I’m talking about. I’m not just talking crazy. Okay.

Adam Marshall: No, no, no, you’re not. But that’s gone now. Oh, what’s interesting. That’s why it can’t be any inducements, which means to stimulate, uh, the sale of alcohol. Like, so an inducement is giving something for free in its purest sense. I happy hour though in which is what you’re talking about, which was only allowed for three, two beer and was and allowed for full strength beer, wine and spirits. Now you can do discounted sales any hour of the day, any day of the week, but it has to be published. It has to be the same for everybody. You can’t do you, you, you. So the alcohol floor price, still alcohol for price is still down there. So you can’t do nickel, nickel ground nights. You can’t do ladies drink free nights, those kinds of things. Those are really getting into inducements. Um, and you can’t do okay if you want to come in between a certain time and say have appetizers and if you order appetizers, you get a half price beer.

Adam Marshall: Um, you just have to have half price beer during half price appetite time. You can’t say if you order an appetizer now you can have half price and you say if you order a beer you can get it half price appetizer or, or some version. No, that’s totally, that would still be an inducement. You’re, you’re giving juicing, eating food. In fact, we can’t give beer away. But what we do to support some local charities around here is, is when they have silent auction items, we may give some gear along with an empty growler and then, and then a gift card. And that gift card can be used to fill the growler. It can be used for and sweatshirts. He can be used to buy smoke la Houma barbecue sauce, which we don’t make, but it’s made by a partner of ours that you’re a big jamoke big demo porter in, in it.

Adam Marshall: And so you, you come here and buy all that stuff. So even if we do like okay we, and a couple of incidences, and this is very rare, but for some, for some big long charitable partners that we’ve had longtime charitable partners that we had, we’ve kind of had to shift under the new laws. But if we say somebody says, hey we want to put together a tap room crawl when we might get together with other breweries and say okay here’s what we’ll do. You want to do that, you’ve got a group coming in. We can reserve a table just like if anybody else called but your ranger with us reserve a table and, and we’ll, we’ll give you a $50 gift certificate that the organizer can put towards buying samples. But you can do anything else but we’re going to charge you for samples when you come cause we have to, we can’t give free beer way.

Adam Marshall: Now saying that there is a side part and the brewery laws, it says you can do free samples up to 12 ounces, one per visitor per day, but you have to have a designated area. And that was a carryover from the old law. And now that we can have tap rooms, there’s really no motivation to have, you know, it’s almost like the snug here. At one point in time we thought was going to be designated as the designated to sampling area. So you’d come in here, you know, use the snug window to the bar and you could do that. If we ever do advertise sampling out, they’re like, we’re going to have a day when you can come sample and go do tours. Uh, we may very well turn this, turn this into the sampling room. Nice. Bring do that. And then that, that, that change is something we, we, we didn’t get a perfect system out of this, but we traded up in the grand scheme of it.

Marshall Morris: So as I’m just like hearing you talk through just these first two, it sounds like one the inducement laws, they are what qualifies as an inducement or what you’re allowed to do or not allowed to do. It moved, it made it harder for restaurants, bars to, to maybe advertise or market. Not impossible by any means, but you know, it just changed the ways that you could do things. And then the happy hour law moved in the other direction. Do these seem like contradictory directions or is it all part of the grand scheme of moving towards a common goal?

Adam Marshall: I think that it, that it always was, uh, uh, I don’t really look at it as moving in different directions, but I see it as, as, as moving in a uniform direction such that we all know what the rules, the rules are, the game. Got It. And so happy hours wouldn’t necessarily a bad thing. And so being able to do a discounted price and not having to run it for a week isn’t necessarily an inducement. It can get traffic into your place, but you’re getting the same, you know, during that time. It’s the same price for everybody. You’re not giving away anything else free. You’re just as a business owner taking a hit on your profitability for that period of time. And so that’s allowed. So is that a kind of inducement? I think you could argue that it is, but it’s one that’s the one that the law lets you do the golden who’s turn is it to go on to get to talk. They call that the golden inducement. Yeah,

Marshall Morris: the golden inducement. So Eric, I also heard that there’s a new law where um, bars and restaurants, they’re not allowed to sell shitty beer.

Eric Chupp: Well then they should only sell Sundown Wheat, and all the other Marshall’s beers.

Adam Marshall: I’ll tell you, we talked about this in the past, but I get so pissed and we go to a bar and they don’t have Marshall’s. I’ve visited, I’ve seen flexibly set so you can drop the f bomb. Just man, I like it. I like your passion, your passion from the Snug because of your passion.

Eric Chupp: Okay. I wanted to ask you before he came out, he had a Sundown Wheat tap for some reason he had a wry, and I gave him a long time ago,

Adam Marshall: You know, in the wild, there’ve been several iterations of ones we’ve had, you know, once we started out with these tap handles. So the ones who started out with it, and there are so many out there in the wild because, because every once in a while you hear a distributor putting a bounty on other distributors tap handles. Oh yeah. It gets at the, at the level.

Adam Marshall: Now that we all have exclusive distributors, you know, I don’t know how much of that is really going on, but, but that happens like, you know, hey, the salespeople, if you take off, if you take off any of the LDF house brands or you take off any of the, any of the, uh, sooner, sooner beer house. Yeah. A little, there’s a little bit of that goes, goes on. But, but you know, it’s not as, yeah, a lot of that stuff is, is, I mean, all all’s fair in love and war, but then that’s another kind that can get, gets in potentially to another kind of inducement at the wholesale to retail level where it’s like wholesalers can’t provide retailers with like, hey, carry this beer and here’s some tickets to the Superbowl. You know, really across the entire ship, out their entire supply chain. There were inducement or r and d elements and laws for inducements, etc.

Adam Marshall: Yeah, and here’s the history behind that. If you go back to prohibition, which let’s take a true bass and especially, you know, mamas, but if we, but if you go back to prohibition, prior to prohibition, you had vertically integrated, eh, that’s prior to prohibition. You had vertically integrated company. She had a Lotta, the railroad was the arteries of commerce. Uh, you had a lot of taverns in towns that the railroads went through and these taverns were owned by the brewing companies. And some of them are part of the big three that are still around today. Some of them are okay, but you’re talking about a time when there really was no aspirin or anything and it was hard. It was hot. You know, there are a lot of people and they’re looking for something that might be a little bit safer to drink than the water.

Adam Marshall: A little bit of a social lubricant to kind of drown a little bit of this, this misery away. And so when you had this vertical integration, uh, of a national alcohol producer in the high, high end markets, they could charge what the market would bear there and have profitability there, but then charge almost nothing along the railroad to just dump this stuff. And it was a real problem. I mean, alcoholism is still a problem, but then, I mean, it, it was a real, it was a real problem just dumping, basically dumping this beer free bags at these brewery tappers and it was called a tied house. We still have regulations that put the federal level and the state level against tied house. So when finally when we repealed prohibition and the federal government wrestled this, the distribution business away from gangsters and, uh, we set these barriers between a manufacturer, a wholesaler, wholesale distributor, and point of sale retail.

Adam Marshall: Those barriers are still around in one form or another in most all 50 states. But there are exceptions for exception manufacturers selling direct to consumer at a tap room in a small brewery. But you know, when you’re going in and, and, and the inducements were the biggest right whole chain. And it was, it was, it was awful. And that’s why, you know, it gave some credence to the temperance movement. I mean, these, these, these workers, these people who are working on the railroad or working in these towns that are expanding the west, a lot of them were men during the day work hitting the head in the pubs, in the taverns. For us, that wasn’t making for a very good home life. So there, there really was, uh, there was some, some, some, some, uh, with the temperance movement, there really was some, some, some social credibility to, to the problems that dumping all this alcohol was causing. But we’re talking over a hundred years ago, but we have to remember, remember history. Uh, yeah. Hopefully accurately, you know, but close to Africa this accurately, so we don’t repeat some of the same, so that’s crazy. Yeah.

Marshall Morris: I, uh, when I went to a, when I went to Spain, I learned a little bit more of the history of Spain and went, hey, bro. And I bust and I’m over here trying to teach all the while, just so that everybody’s listening. We’re playing a game of Jenga, Jenga, Jenga, janks. Um, and uh, while we were in Spain, they were talking about the history of, of Spain. And there was apparently, I can’t remember, I’m going to butcher this. Somebody is going to correct us. But, um, there was a king or a queen where there was a plague going around and they had to fix this and they realize that there’s no consistent like commonality between all the people that were getting sick. And so they said, well, it’s either the, the air or it’s the water and everybody in. So, so everybody was like, well, you know, we’ve got gotta fix this plague in. It was in Madrid, it was where we were staying. And I was on this tour. Are they explaining this to us? And you look at people in of Madrid and they party on and they say it’s rooted in our history and they’re telling us this story. And they say, well, if it’s the air, then we’re all fucked.

Marshall Morris: So, but if it’s the water, we got to stop drinking the water to get everybody healthy. So there was a point in time where they outlawed the drinking of water of their water. And so that’s, so everybody was getting hammered all the time.

Eric Chupp: Three year olds. I live by those same rules.

Adam Marshall: I don’t want to drink the water. But that brings up an interesting point, interesting historical point from like antiquity, because think about this. We know that there have been intentionally grain-based fermented beverages. We have archeological evidence from the end of the last ice age when she was nine, 10,000 years ago. In fact, uh, one of our colleagues in the industry, uh, dogfish head has had partnered up with the University of university park. I don’t know, I think I got bonus points because I was able to remove for moving to, he pulled out is that one and another one fell out, but the rest of the tower is still standing. Somebody needs to comment on, I’m pretty sure you just lost, I’m pretty, no, no, no, no. We keep going. Well, we’re going to be, this is the, this is interesting because like our friends at dogfish head yes, did, did, uh, partnered up with U Penn and an Rko chemist there and who had gone around and studied some of these old tombs where they’d found drinking vessels that had remanence of intentionally fermented beverages in there.

Adam Marshall: And one of the oldest ones, this particular professor had studied and you can go look, look, look, all this up, I don’t know all the names, but was one that, uh, was about 9,000 years old. They think it may have been around the air of King Midas. Some people said my be King Midas, but there’s some other Chinese and maybe the Chinese one was 9,000 years old. And they say, trust the midas touch. We’re talking old, old, this was pre hip, pre written history. But they found these drinking vessels and they could chemically analyze what this was. So it was an alcohol product. It was, it had grain fermentation, some of it had a little bit of grape grape essence and fermentation in there. So, so w dogfish head was kind of, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, they, they propelled further this notion of an Rko beer and trying to recreate it.

Adam Marshall: Now I say propelled further because the pioneer in this was actually Fritz Maytag, who owned, who was, who’s been one of the longest craft brewers and, uh, out at, uh, uh, uh, anchor steam. So Fritz Maytag bought an old brewery, has anchor steam brewery. I believe it’s been sold. Don’t quote me on that. And we talking about anyway, in hundreds of are we talking, you know, we’re talking about the mid, I mean we’re talking about the 1970s, 1980s. Okay. So one of his most famous famous contributions to this area of argue beer was working. There was this, there was this cuneiform tablet that was found in Sumeria and uh, in, in the Fertile Crescent area and, and, and, and it was a hymn to the goddess of Beer Ninkasi. And so from that, him, they were able to derive a recipe, a recipe, a recipe. So this is actually not necessarily, well, here’s the interesting, this is actually known as the first, uh, the first like written recipe as far as I know, written recipe from, from history, right.

Adam Marshall: So what they, what they were able to derive from this, now we don’t know exactly what they were using, but basically was, they would take a, what was very common at the time, a way of preserving bread was to basically dry it out. Put it together with maybe some honey, some other stuff, and make this loaf, it’s a flat, unleavened loaf, uh, with, with grain cracked but not cracked up. Like we can wait, like we can walk, we can flower make flower. It wasn’t flowers, a very, very coarse ground sort of grain. And so they, they flatten it out and they’d dry in the sun and this stuff could be stored for a year or so. It was like sundown wheat.

Adam Marshall: But then you would take this and this, this bap peers, what they called it, which was a flat flat, this flat twice kind of dried out honey water and grain. And they were, we’re talking old, old heirloom grains, like spelt, maybe buckwheat, some of those other things. Uh, and so then you would take that raw ingredients and then you would crush that up and you could do two things with that barrier. You could then make 11 bread with it. And a lot of it was sour doughs cause we’re dealing with wild use at the time. Or you can make liquid bread, which was beer. And so this recipe that was, that was derived from that. Um, and I don’t know it no total off the top of my head, but it’s this bag here that’s got some spell, some, some, some, some honey mixed in.

Adam Marshall: And the way you can do it, it’s actually one of the homebrew recipes. It’s in the, it’s in Charlie. Charlie Papazian is homebrew book about, you know, ancient recipes. Uh, and actually made it one time, and I’ll get into that here in a second. I made it, worked with my old archaeology professor at the University of Tulsa and actually made this beer years later after I had, if you call it liquid bread, no, no, no, no, no. But, but it was, that would be a good beer name. But basically you had, you had the base ingredient, which was, which was the beer honey and grains. You crush that up, you add it to some water. They weren’t really boiling as much, but the stuff could get heated and usually be heated by a fire. But if you didn’t have a metal, a metal or a pot, you know what a fire pot that could stand in the heat, you would actually put hot stones down in to heat the water up.

Adam Marshall: And that’s how you, that’s how you would, you would, you would get the heat and then you would add some dates in there and finally come up with this sweet liquid that was like a war. There’s no hops in it or anything like that. And then, uh, you would use whatever east you are using for your bread around the time it was a sourdough you. So I actually ordered from it from a company that Charlie Papazian his books as to order from or mentions a company, a Dead Sea strain of yeast, which was a sourdough strain, made a sourdough starter out of it, you know, to propagate the yeast and get a yeast fermentation and fermented this thing out. It’s crazy. And it came out very, I mean, very much different than what we would consider beer today because there’s no hops. It’s not, not hot heavy with with mark malted barley, but it was about 2.8% alcohol and it was very, and how to sourness, kind of like a sulfury sourness, like in a very sulfury red wine.

Adam Marshall: But it was tolerable and it was safer than water. I mean, so that’s when we’re getting it. I mean, you had this, you in there, there are actually all sorts of archeological evidence and prehistoric evidence that the intentionally fermented beverages came about at the time of the domestication of plants because you had bread and then you had liquid bread and liquid bread. I mean, you go, you can get the cleanest river you want to, let’s go to the mountains of Colorado and find it right from the source before beavers of shit in it and all that kind of stuff. You know, there’s a lot of that beavers, marmots, Hey, nice Marmot, you know, shop shit in the water and put Montezuma’s revenge in their, whatever else. Grd of that kind of stuff. You take the cleanest water, you put it in a clay pot and then I make beer and put it in a clay pot.

Adam Marshall: You let it set for a week. I’m fucking drinking the beer. I’m not drinking that water. Just get sick as fuck. Yeah. Yeah. And so throughout history, before people were boiling water and hell before people figured out distillation and all that kind of shit and other ways of purifying water, um, this was a way to get your liquid requirement because the diuretic effect from alcohol was negligible because we’re only talking about 2% alcohol by volume switch the stuff. Right. It was enough for a social lubricant and it, and then you fast forward kind of past Sumerian times in the Egyptian times, which there’s actually a, there’s actually a originally a, an archaeology professor and I can’t remember where he’s from, but named Mendleson who’s part of his dairy on how the pyramids were built. Dealt with. Okay. Farrow would say, okay, all you farmers out there and people, I know that the Nile floods every year and when it floods your farming, they were shit.

Adam Marshall: So during the year, I’m going to take good care of you. I’m going to take roads, I’m going to do all this. Why don’t you pay me some taxes in the form of this? Like they had their own former kind of unleavened bread away to store grains. So I’m going to store this shit. And then when the Nile floods, why don’t you all come? Because, because Symira Agrarian, semi agrarian folks, which is still got together to aggregate and aggregating was important because you didn’t, or Mary, you throw big parties and all that Hay while the Niles flooding want you all come aggregate during the day. You’re going to move some big fucking blocks for me and we’re going to build this pyramid and we’re going to do it to God, right? And to me the God and every night I’m going to throw a party with you because I’ve got all this, this taxes you paid.

Adam Marshall: I got bread, I got beer red. Yeah, and liquid bread. And so everybody gets together, party in her and then they go back to their farms and all I know. So, you know, be bigger, was very intentionally fermented beverage was very good at what, I wonder what time of year the Nile would typically flood. And I wonder if there’s still any traditions that we celebrate now that come from that time. I think that’s probably why we need to, we need to go over to t you and find a professor and know some shit about that to come talk about it. Unfortunately, my, the archaeology professor, I have a Georgia Dell, great guy. He passed away several years ago, but he was, he was, uh, uh, I was just filling some electives and I had, I had, uh, uh, known, uh, Professor Odell from kind of another community activity.

Adam Marshall: We interesting. We both sang in the Tulsa opera together when I was a senior in high school and he was a, he did that dude. It’s crazy. I didn’t know that. So anyway, it was just, it was a short, it was a short opera career. Yeah, it was a short hop to Korea. Right. Wait, what do we get there? But, but, but uh, but professor O’Dell and the other, the other interesting thing, oh, I can’t do that. Sorry. Let me explain this. I can’t Jenga and talk about the other way I knew professor Odell is that when I was in about a seventh grade, I needed some service hours for a scout badge. So I went there building the Kimberly Clark facility over on the west side of the river and they had to stop it because they found these archeological ruins. Oh really? So state law says you’ve got to stop, you’ve got to do a dig.

Adam Marshall: They called in Odell, he’s the resonant archeologist from the professor. He goes, I just go out there to volunteer. And that’s the first time I met him. He didn’t remember that. But anyway, it took some nice classes from the guy. So then after I go to law school, I come back, I joined the homebrew club. He’s, I see him out, uh, you know, enjoying good beers. We get to talk and he’s like, let’s make this beer. I’ll do all the heavy work, but why don’t you come and talk about it. When we unveil it to the home brew club and he did and it was so great because he was so vested in the community. And uh, you know, the archeological dig back, uh, back at the Kimberly Clark. That’s a whole other thing. I wish we could get him on and talk about it, but maybe, maybe we talked about that some other time.

Eric Chupp: That’s awesome.

Adam Marshall: It’s really interesting cause cause that ended up, we, and I know we’re just going wherever, but that ended up figuring out a, the destination of a, of a French explorer that’s made its way up into this area. And, and uh, I mean we’re talking, uh, I don’t want to quote it, but what we’re talking maybe late 1700, something like that. Mid 17 hundreds, uh, an explorer name Le Harp and Professor Odell worked on that for years and actually went to find this guy’s journal and an archive in France somewhere and read it. And then, and then took his directions and how he measured distances and how, yeah, how we measure distances. And everything. And then they plotted it and ended up very near where the archeological site was. So that was the evidence we got to, Oh my God, this was actually a pretty major spot there. And anyway, that’s a whole [inaudible]

Marshall Morris: Very major spot. Cool job. Can you imagine being hung over and then, uh, and then going and moving to ton blocks all day in the sun with no shade.

Eric Chupp: Well, I can maybe imagine it a little more than you.

Eric Chupp: I can maybe imagine it a little more than you would realize because I used to pour concrete through high school and college. I’ve maybe had bitch make any pyramids to be hung over and then have to go like move manmade rock, which is kind of all around. Uh, interesting. I’ll you, yeah. You want to know about the first time I ever got drunk? Sure. All right. It was in high school as well as Marshall know the story already. I don’t know. Probably not. This is my senior year of high school. Uh, I was waiting to sports, so I didn’t really drink or party too much at that point. And, uh, me and two of my buddies that were kind of, you know, they would do a little cab. What types? Um, they’d been drinking bud light for years and whatever other for 17 years old. And uh, we’re going to go to a party, but we’re going to go to my buddy. He, this is how much cowboys there? He’s 17. He lives in his own trailer house, like out in verticals go. Yeah. So we go over to get his mama to sign off on it. Right. Like you can move them.

Eric Chupp: So we’re going to go over there and we got a tweet, you know, it’s hard to get beer at 16, 17 years old. So we got us a 24, not impossible, a 24 pack of bottles. Right. And we’re going to drip pregame that. We’re going to go to a buddy’s house. He stole it a party. He got a kegger raging, raging a or understands all of the sudden it might junior. This must have been my junior year actually. Um, and so we go over there and my buddy that lived at the place was in there with his girlfriend fight and for like hours and we, so me and my other friend said on the front porch and soon was a girlfriend. They were like 16, like 16. We’re seeing real, real adults linked. Literally they’re like, you know, we hear him in there and they’re like bang in and then they’re yelling at each other and then they’re banging again.

Eric Chupp: And then they’re young and it’s literally for hour and a half. Me and my other Buddy Kelly, we sit on the front porch and we ended up 12 beers each. My first time to ever drink, we kill this 24 part. Maybe it was like a 20 pack of bottles or something weird. Right. Anyways, six pack, we get to this party and I’m shit faced. Like I don’t even hardly remember half the night and I had to get up at like 5:00 AM the next morning and go to work with my dad. And so, uh, make it home, whatever happens, you know, the night was crazy. You get home and we’d get up and I’m riding out to a job with them in the morning and I have to have him. He’s like, Hey, partying last night time. And I’m like, oh no. It was just, Oh, some foods, you know. And he goes, he’s like, you smelled like beer.

Speaker 5: And I go, yeah, Jeremy spilled a beer on me or something, you know the first person to come up with that as news. And then literally five minutes later I had to make him pull over so I could throw up on the side of the road. He’s like, really? And he didn’t, he never gave me any shit about it because the punishment of that entire day, we were like demo in a slab. Go Dude. I was literally, we’ll barreling toward how God, what did you do at the end of that day? I was just throwing up all day. I mean it was sick as hell and I just went to sleep as soon as you get back in the truck on the way home, it was the war. One of the worst things. I learned my lesson. I’m not, I mean, that’s when it’s like time to drink. When you know, when a parent recognizes that you just need to live with your consequences.

Adam Marshall: I’ve got kids, you’ve got kids. My kids don’t have kids. It does Marshall as a kid. I am a kid as far as I know. My kids aren’t, uh, you know, drinking yet. Got younger kids and then a freshman in high school. But uh, you know, but, but when you’re at that point where it’s like, okay, the punishment enough, it’s just what you got to live with. Kinda given me, you know, he didn’t even tell my mom, right? Like, hey, nobody was just like one of those cool dad moments when he was on. He has made me work. He caught me hiding behind the building one at one point. And he walked around and very calmly and he said, hey, I don’t care what your choices were last night. We got a job to do today. He basically is like, you got five minutes to get your, this is the real world.

Adam Marshall: Well, it’s kind of like, I grew up with a couple of brothers and there was some brothers that I grew up with and know one time they ended up with a pack of cigarettes smoking or something like that. And Dad caught him as like, okay, smoked the whole up and they turn green. I don’t think they ever picked up a cigarette ever again. I mean that’s a fine line because you’re dealing with neuro chemistry there. Am I getting them with a pen?

Eric Chupp: Give me another patch, I got lucky with the whole tobacco scene. I don’t know what your guys’ experiences. My mom smoked cigarettes when I was little and it always made me sick so I didn’t, wasn’t inclined to do that. And I dipped two times in high school and like you just said, just green threw up someone like, fuck this. I’m not doing any of that stuff.

Marshall Morris: So Adam, maybe you can break this down. We were talking about dogfish head, um, before they make some of my favorite beer. I really loved it there. I love their IPA line. Um, the, the 90 or the 60, 90 at one 20 minute Ipa. Um, and somewhere I want, I want you, this is another set the record straight. Okay. Um, call Marshall the record. Yeah. The, yeah, very straight get out of here. Um, and so they, so I bought a four pack of this 120 minute Ida and I’ve been aging it for about a year and a half because I heard that you were, I heard that, I heard that if you age it, it becomes almost like a barley wine. And I don’t understand any of the chemistry of that. And so am I just, am I ruining a four pack of dogfish head right now or, or what’s going on?

Adam Marshall: I’m not as versed on the chemistry. We, we may need to grab the other, the, the other martial Eric Marshall, which leans on him real quick. Here’s what I do know. Higher Strength Beers lend themselves a little bit better to cellaring like cellaring wine, you know, so. So, uh, there is, uh, there are certain beers out there like one of the most sought after beers in the world, best Valtra in which is made by the monks of this filter. And, uh, their beers actually come on, come with a drink after date, uh, on the cap. Um, and so you need to keep them so that the time will blend the flavors a little more and smooth things out because there are chemical changes that will continue to go on time. Kaitlin. The flavors of life, you know, you don’t want to place, it’s too hot.

Adam Marshall: I mean cellaring find a place that is close as you can in your house, like a seller to like, you know, you know, put up a little bit lower. Yeah. Not at all. A little bit lower and until in the backyard. But yeah, no, so, so there is cellaring and so with that particular beer, I don’t know, it’s a delicious beer. Um, but, but it depends on, I mean, you, you could probably find someone out there that’s had it for five years and said, hey, it was great. Now, I mean there, there are people out there that trade beers and do all this and then they, they may even do like vertical tastings where it’s like they’ll take, you know, beers from different years. And I don’t think they do that with 120 minute where they do like the year on it. But take a take an example like a Sierra Nevada’s big foot barley wine that they’ll have a year stamp on the cap.

Adam Marshall: And so they may get around some bags, some people. And every once in a while we’ll have some, some beer fans cause our brewers, they may have some people over in the production facility after hours and say, okay, bring what you’ve collected. And there may be a vertical tasting through several years of bigfoot barley wine. Um, so you do like a 2018, 2017, 16 or whatever. Yeah, that’s exactly right. And in fact, in effect there was a, there was a stone, and I don’t know if they still do this, but stone did this series called vertical epic that had several years and, and so, uh, it was designed to have two seller and have a vertical tasting. And so that’s a cool concept. But bigger beers, I wouldn’t tell you to do that with, I mean the 60 minute IPA and that they have are high enough.

Adam Marshall: Yeah, it’s not high enough. I mean, you’re really looking at at, at, at imperial strength beers are high alcohol, beer, something north of seven, 8% that I think you’re really going to be amenable to settling the bonsai of the beer world. Right. You know, it’s sending all these years in advance and you’re like kind of him maybe like the whiskey or the wine. I mean you’ve got vintages. It’s almost like the wine, the wine side of the beer industry. Well, I probably should have tasted in aged beer, like Millard beer before I decided to do that. But then again, I bought like, you know, like four or five, four bags. I dragged the others. I remember my parents had one and I think they had a couple and then they age a couple bottles of it and they had one the other night and they split. One was like, no.

Marshall Morris: They said, wait, do we only have half a beer? Like what’s going on? Because it’s a, it’s such a high pony native, but a beer like that. Yeah, it’s more immutable because there’s two things. There’s, there’s two things that add to the preservative feature that naturally want to, one is the alcohol content, which has an antiseptic quality to it. The other is the hop content, which is higher, which has, which changes the ph because you’re after acids in the, in the, in the hop, in hop cones. And so higher IB use higher alcohol is a beer that’s going to sell or longer and be better longer. Um, when you’re talking, when you, when you reverse and you’re going down to standard Pale Ales, uh, that are in the 5% range, um, you’re, you’re talking about loggers, man, I wouldn’t, I mean you hold those past this past year.

Adam Marshall: Now if it’s an imperial lager, that’s a different thing. I’m just talking standard premiums. I mean it’ll, it’ll, it’ll get shitty. I got her a while. That takes me to the next question. I remember hearing people talk about Skunky Beer, skunky Vr, what makes us skunky beer? Is it temperature, tame changes over and over is a age. What I and what is that is it does actually go bad or if people just because it’s an awful laver and um, I’m not as versed as I used to be on the off flavors. There’s actually a beer judge certification program, Bjc p that you can go through. They do it over to high gravity, the local a beer place. But in the, in the, in the brewing community, there are the Bjc p guidelines on styles and it says what the styles are supposed to be, but off flavors are part of it.

Adam Marshall: And so the skunk off play flavor usually as a product of being light struck. And how does a beer become light struck? It becomes light struck through its bottle. Which amber bottles generally are better. They’re not, they’re not 100% but they’re better at keeping a beer from being light and then a green or a clear bottle. And so a lot of people out there may have, may have, I’ve heard described beers like Heineken has skunky you know, and that may very well be because the beer that they’ve had, if it’s in a six pack and it’s a green bottle, it’s been light struck and we’ll add that flavor. Now there was a rumor, just a rumor, I don’t know out there that the American tastes and people that liked Heineken, actually we’re used to that skunky that when it was brewed under the supervision of [inaudible] get up in Canada somewhere at one point in time, they actually had to make it a little with a little bit of an off waiver to it because you know, if you go where to have go have Heineken in Amsterdam on draft, there’s a little bit different flavor debt.

Adam Marshall: And, and to this day, uh, I will drink beer that comes in a green or a clear bottle. But it’s generally only if it’s been in a, in a 12 pack. That’s been completely covered or it’s been in a case that hasn’t been opened. And if that beer will come in a can, you know, you got the grenade, you’ve got the grenade cans and Heineken has a Newcastle’s another one that does Newcastle Brown has another one that does a, does a clear bottle. The new castle cans. To me it’s still a diff, it’s a difference. It can, it can be skunky. Yeah, no and it can, can’t get light struck. That’s one of the great things about a can, uh, an amber, we’ll, we’ll kind of hold off the white striking, but it can still happen after a certain period of time. Can never gets light struck. That’s one of the things like w like cans were initially really slow to adopt out there, but now they’re everywhere.

Adam Marshall: I mean most breweries that are crappers that are starting out and getting into into singles or packaging are not even going to the bottle. They’re going straight to the CAN. We were kind of one of the last ones that went straight to the bottle because there weren’t that many canning options out there and there were still kind of a slow uptake. But for a lot of reasons and in Boston Beer Samuel ons put off the can for a long, long time. But now they have it right. But, but the reasons is, you know, can technology for 30 years has had the specialty line can that doesn’t get any aluminum flavor into it. So that’s, that’s that, that’s horse shit argument. If somebody tells you that anymore, the second thing you that horse shit. Yeah. Shit. Yeah. The second thing is that you can’t get light light through there and if your process is good enough to where you feel and then, and then and then put the, put the top on the can quick enough, you’re going to have low oxygen uptake in there, which which, which, which is good.

Adam Marshall: And then it’ll last a little longer on the shelves. It’s much more convenient out there for all sorts of reasons. You can get more ounces of beer on a truck with a can then you can with a bottle cause it can’t, I packages is lighter. And for that reason for, for Bert Breweries that are very motivated by their environmental impact, new Belgium being one of them, they went to the camp because of the reduced their carbon footprint. I mean absolutely did. And so in every little thing counts when you’re, you’re a brewery that big and so then they’re much easier to stack and retail and that’s one of the reasons Marshall ultimately we went to the Cannes this last year and we’re not going to give up the bottle. We get our bottles from, from SAPULPA. We love supporting the economy but we have one beer, this land lager and we may have another this next year that shows up in, in a can but, but, but, but those, those are made for the convenience and grocery store channels where stackability and movability and all these kinds of things are important in a can is just lends itself more to that.

Eric Chupp: If you have an accident, Java, a bunch of cans makes a lot less of a mess. And if that’s exactly right. Okay. So can, well what happens to the Can of beer and maybe I’ve had some friends in the past who had put ice chest full of beer and then four months later that bear is still in the ice chest and it’s been sitting in the driveway. But hypothetically, what happens to that hypothetical candidate beer smack in the middle of the summer? I mean temperature, it depends on the style of beer. There are some beers that are grades. If it’s, yeah, dude, if it’s, sorry, natty light. If it’s, if it’s, if it’s, if it’s a, if it’s a lower and light beer, um, shitty. You know, if it was, if it was like, I mean if we was like in Mad Max land and I ran across a bunch of beer like that, I’d drink to shit.

Adam Marshall: I cool it down and drink the shit out of it. One, I’d clean the fucking can off because you don’t know what’s growing on that shit. Sanitize a shit about more on the outside. But inside they can relatively be okay. But it’s probably has been there so long that it’s to unlicensed. Unless it’s been flash pasteurized, it’s probably going to ask some other, which most crappers don’t do. But the big brewers do some sort of flash pasteurization is probably going to be safe to drink. It’s probably not going to taste great. Temperature shocks are one of the worst things out there for beer. If you just shocked at me, he said, listen, if it’ll be, it’ll be, if it’ll rank pretty good, you know, whatever my turn, it’s typically Adam’s turning, so I don’t know. Um, okay. Let’s, I’m gonna, I’m gonna just, we’re going to get, and the weeds.

Eric Chupp: Adam, when you ready to get in the weeds, weeds, talk to us about your anus.

Adam Marshall: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. You’re funny. Yeah, it is. No, no. I, I’m, I’m a big, I’m a big science nerd out there. Uh, if you already are already, can’t tell about a little bit of the science. I know you know about, about beer. Uh, but a big, big stuff at the turn of the year was, uh, there’s this little probe, uh, speaking of your, a little bit, the little, the little probe that could, unfortunately, it didn’t go to Uranus as the astrophysics community profitable say because, so assholes, like you guys talked to Steve. But this new horizons probe really interesting. Gail was launched in 2005, 2006 took it nine years to get to Pluto and it flew by Pluto in 2015 really interesting story. I mean, uh, Pluto as we know now.

Adam Marshall: It’s not a planet. I want Pluto to come back as a planet. It’s a flute up back again. And it better be a bring Pluto back. I, I, but, but here’s one of the, cause I grew up, we had nine planets. Now we’ve got eight and a Shitload of Dwarf Planet. But you can look at this two different ways. You can look at Pluto is the tiny one of all the big fucking giants or the biggest one of the tinies. It’s kind of like, uh, uh, what was it? Uh, but, but not in a way like, you know, 16 candles. Do you all ever see that? Maybe you guys are younger? I said no, he’s too young. When Anthony Michael Hall played this nerdy guy who was kind of like King of the dip shits, you know, so I don’t think, you know, being the king of the dwarf planets as that’d be good, but, but it takes a little time.

Adam Marshall: But there was this debate in the astronomical community actually. There was a fun, yeah, there’s actually a guy, and I forget his name, wrote a book called called how I killed Pluto and why. And it talked about, you know, his role in the astronomical community as far as the debate that happened on what’s a planet and what’s not a planet. Because if we, if we had found so many, so, so it wasn’t till recently, relatively recently when, you know, Pluto was discovered. I mean, like finally seen sometime in the 70s. I think that might be that it’s in the Kuiper belt, right? Yeah. Well, we didn’t know 30, 30, 40 years ago that there were more objects. We just thought that, okay, you go out there and then it’s just nothing until you get to the next solar system that you might intersect. Now we know there’s this cloud out there of objects that are left over from, from the inner solar system.

Adam Marshall: So what’s interesting is new horizons got to Pluto and nine what is the new horizon? You know, horizons was approved through the JPL probe. NASA launched fucking silky launched in like 2006 it because they, they were speeding it as fast as they could to Pluto. It was the fastest probe like ever launched admin escape velocity at Earth, like a crash car of a bro. No, I crossed the orbit of Mars and then gravity assisted from Jupiter than cross. The other giant planet. Orbits have shown this. The slingshot effect cross cross the orbit of Saturn crossed the orbit of Uranus Cross the orbit of Neptune and then finally made its encounter with Pluto. Would it? Shit never orbit it. It’s going so fast in order to put on the brakes and actually orbit, but it showed us displaced. It was very looked very much like a lot of ways, Mars, um, mountains and everything but similar geological processes.

Adam Marshall: But like so many other cold places, different materials being, yeah, a lot of water, ice, those kind of things. And it captured Pluto. And then Pluto’s a want to Pluto satellites, biggest satellite chair and that kind of orbit each other. But during this time, during its flight before it and made it to 2020 to, to Pluto in 2015, there’s a whole team of scientists like, okay, once we accomplish our primary mission, where the fuck are we going next? Keeping going to utilize this. We know this thing’s going to get sent out in the solar system and actually going so fast that, I mean it’s faster than the other probes that have left the solar system. But, but they were like, we know there’s this cloud of objects out there. Uh, Kuyper belt objects. We, we, we’d love to try to find another one. Well, these things are so dim and, and, and, and, and, and, and the one that it just recently flew by and it made an account or of which is fairly historic, is one called ultimate Tooley and where the name came from, I don’t know but, but ultimately is a Kaiper belt object, which they call a contact binary, which means it was basically two balls a fucking rock that just smash together and it looks like a snowman.

Adam Marshall: We don’t really know how it rotates or orbits, but it does, it orbits around the Sun. It takes a couple of hundred years, but it’s only about 20 miles like long and 10 miles wide about the size of a city, you know, a small city. And so they had to find this thing in order to direct it and they had to do it. They had to find it by 2014 in or in order to set the course. The course that when they went around or, or flew by Pluto that it would go to this next thing. There’s a fascinating, actually I believe in science. This kind of says what fascinated this is all math. That’s what I’m saying. There was like, there’s a fascinating Nova that came out days later, just all about this, um, that I would encourage anybody to do out there watch. But it was fascinating how they actually found this object because it doesn’t reflect a whole lot of sun.

Adam Marshall: I mean, our son was like a tiny ass thing. So what they had to do is they had to look at a field of stars and through research and all this predict where they think there might be an awkward station, uh, uh, uh, uh, a covering of a star by this object. So they’re basically looking at it to transit and Demo Star, the walking, see in the background. It took all my three or four times, they had to go to like the middle of the Pacific on a damn. Uh, seven 47 that had a satellite in it, couldn’t get it that time. They had to go to some other place in the world. Finally, there was something set up. And Patagonia, they set up these five satellites, these five, uh, uh, telescopes that we’re about, you know, several kilometers from each other but in the same area, they were lined up to capture what they thought the damning.

Adam Marshall: So they’d had three, two or three tries before where they fail to get the dimming. They thought finally they get it. But with math in the way these five telescopes at all caught it, caught the dimming were spaced out. They could then get by the pattern of the dim what they thought this looked like. Because before they didn’t know if this object they were looking for was just an oblong football looking thing. If it was a little bit more round, but these four things gave him a prediction, we think this thing might look like a figure eight. That’s crazy. And sure enough what they predicted. It looked like when they finally took a picture of this damn thing, it looked like a figure eight. I mean this, and this was all math. This is all about, this is all about, you know, looking science inquiry where it’s going, making a prediction that then comes true.

Adam Marshall: And now the prediction didn’t come to a couple of times, they couldn’t read you it. And it’s really hard to view this shit from, from our earth. Um, but uh, but, but, but, but they viewed it, they finally got it and then they set the course and they went by and it looked exactly like what they thought it looked like from Earth. And I mean we’re talking about we’re, we’re using the same math to send these probes out there that the Greeks had and everything. And, and so, uh, orbital orbital mechanics and all of this go back to things we learned in high school like Pi, the relationship between the diameter and the circumference of a circle and, and all these kinds of things. And, and, and, and I mean, I think it’s, it’s, it’s amazing because now we see this in one of the oldest things ever photographed in the solar system leftover from the formation

Adam Marshall: of the solar system. And we just got a few pics of it. But man,

Eric Chupp: it’s like, are you in any this stuff at all Marshall? Are you interested by this stuff?

Marshall Morris: I love this stuff.

Adam Marshall: We do. I need, see, I’m totally enthralled by it. One thing I’ve, I’ve thought about recently, I was just cruising Twitter, cruising the Internet, and I was looking at all these photos of Mars, right? And like we have this rover on Mars, we got all of this stuff, and I was thinking like the common person, we get to see some shit that the most wealthy, most influential people throughout history have never even dreamed of seeing. We’ve seen the surface of Mars, right? We know what it’s made of. We’ve seen these little objects. There’s no other human hit in history who has seen that object with their eyes. Absolutely. Right. And we get to just fucking seat on our phones. Yeah. You just get to pull it out of my pocket and I’m like, there’s a damn robot driving around on Mars right now. Here’s a law that was taken a few days ago. Right. You know? Now here’s, here’s the other thing.

Adam Marshall: Think behind the scenes on some of this stuff might turn the modem, if you will. The downlink speed from this premise probe one, it takes like something like not nine hours or something crazy like that to get the signal here, but it’s, the data is being transmitted at one to two kilobits per second. The data they collected on the fly by, it’s going to take them 20 months to download. That’s crazy because one, they’ve got to do it with the deep space network and just pray. But you got something that putting out, you know, one to two K it’s, it’s, it’s a, it’s got a nuclear power generator on it, which is, you know, we’ll keep it alive for a while, but still, there’s only so much you can do. And a lot of people don’t understand that. The fact that a few days later we already got pictures of this thing from a two k download speed, uh, over, you know, far away we talking a man, I don’t, I don’t even, you just Google that because I mean, we’re talking something that’s traveling all 300 miles an hour again, is an hour. Marshall, what? What’s the pro called? Uranus a new horizons new horizons. All right. I’m gonna look it up in March. We’ll talk. Okay.

Marshall Morris: No, I, I think, uh, it’s very fascinating in the hole you set deep space network and all I can think about is like the dial up a dial up connection that’s going through the is the through space. There’s a wire. Ultimate stool is the Kuyper belt object. That is, yes. I want you guys to guess how far away from Earth it is. Is it measured in astronomical units?

Adam Marshall: I mean, I, I, I that that’s the thing. I still don’t even have a full concept of astronomical distances and much less. How many miles away do you think it is?

Marshall Morris: How far is Oklahoma City from here?

Eric Chupp: 90 miles.

Marshall Morris: All right.

Adam Marshall: 300 billion.

Marshall Morris: I’m gonna guess like, probably less than that.

Marshall Morris: Okay. I’m going to guess like it least 1100 miles. Yeah.

Eric Chupp: It’s like Hawaii, Florida.

Adam Marshall: $1 approach on the price is right. I don’t get this call cause I went over it soon as close.

Eric Chupp: Uh, Marshall’s closest and technically by a shit ton, 4 billion miles. You were only off by 396 billion. Technically speaking, that may be the worst guests in history. You were off by 394 bill, 96 billion units, 296 fully appreciate that kind of innocence. The human brain cannot tell the difference between 4 billion in 300 billion in your mind isn’t like, can’t even process that shit, but you know, it’s 4 billion. Think about that. We sent a thing that we can control and get data back from 4 billion mile and it’s not the first one.

Adam Marshall: You know, we’ve got four, three if not four probes that have left, uh, pioneer, the two pioneers in the two voyagers, two pioneers in two voyagers that of her left the helio pause. I don’t know. You’d have to look out, but I don’t know. It’s not mine. I think it is yours. No, I just went up to martial starting then. Um, so how are we going to look? How far the farthest probe is? Yeah, I mean you, I don’t know how you really, I don’t know which. This is what I want to know is what beer these astronomers are drinking. Did they take beer with him? Space astronauts, you know, they don’t, but Russian cosmonauts have been allowed. I believed at vodka. Uh, they were on mirror because the fucking Russians owned me here. But I think the cosmonauts, I don’t know what the status is on the international space station was going to be interesting is, you know, uh, I mean we, we’re, we’re almost into another on the cusp, but I think a full blown, full blown spray story with China.

Adam Marshall: If anything. No. Yeah, that was the only thing. We got some great news as, as, as a, as a species, we got some great advancements. One, we view a Kuyper belt object. Uh, that’s that far to, you know, China lands a probe and a rover on the far side, not the dark side, the far side of the moon. And, uh, that’s, that’s pretty amazing. And here’s the interesting thing about the Chinese space program. One. Their logo looks like it’s the United Federation of planets from Star Trek, which I think is an interesting coincidence to, to uh, to they have set these deadlines. They had several false starts in the eighties and nineties. But then finally the Shinzou

Adam Marshall: Shinzo I think program Shinzo five wants their first person in 2003. But since then they’ve set these, these dates that have been out. But Dave Maddow, you know, we’re going to put this base station up. We’re going to land on the moon. So they’re saying moon base 2030, not far away. And that’s one thing when you have a central government that controls all of this stuff, that sets a timeline, a realistic timeline made it, and it’s all about project management. You meet it now, and that’s a problem we have. So Bushes, oh, we’re going back to the moon. Obama says, no, we’re not going to the moon. We already been there. Let’s go to Mars. Then Trump says, oh, we’re going back to the moon, but nobody wants to fund shit. I mean, you end up just going, no way. Meanwhile, a Richard Branson with his space program. A Virgin Virgin Galactic Galactic. Yeah. They do their, they do their first private flight for, for space travel to go to the edge. Right. Parabolic trajectory. But I think they’re going to be taking people this year. And then you’ve got people like Elon Musk out there who, who were, and also,

Eric Chupp: and if you know this, but android is, I want you guys to guess how far the farthest probe is away from the sun at this point. Got It. How many miles? First of all, let Adam go first. Okay. Can be it again. 10 billion, 1200 miles. This son of a bitch. Uh, actually Adam one, this is six point 4 trillion miles away. Trillion. 16 nine astronomical units. Which probe is that? The one I believe urinate.

Eric Chupp: Yeah. Voyager one reached 69 astronomical units. It’s traveling at 11 miles per second. 6,000,000,000,606 point. Yeah. Yeah. 6 trillion. 409 or stand is like, it’s like it was only within the last decade or so that it left when we call the helio pause, which basically means that the influence of

Adam Marshall: our sun’s gravity stops and you’re an intercellular. Yeah. That’s cool. Yeah. I mean it’s can’t be right. I feel like I did some math wrong, but anyway, we’re going to come. Right. You might have bud, but uh, yeah, we got these things that are just going to go and I don’t think anything’s point 4 billion. You want them to, yeah. You want that, you know, were at, you said 6.4 billion, which is different than trillion. A lot different. Yeah.

Eric Chupp: Adam won barely by 4 billion.

Adam Marshall: Yeah, but see, it’s, it’s beyond, it’s beyond where new horizons is. But I like, you know, see a projection on if there’s a time when new horizons, because it’s going so fast. If it’s gonna, if it’s gonna out, if it’s going to overtake, we know that a voyager, because voyager overtook pioneer. Voyager is going 11 miles per second. So I’m gonna look up, what is it, what’s the new one? New Horizons for a second man. This is turning into a math world. This is so interesting to turn it into math word problems. I feel like new horizon was a John Pars soundtrack to something. You know what’s interesting, one of the science investigators know the one of the science investigators on the new horizon mission is an astrophysicist, phd by the name of Brian May. Okay. It’s the same Brian May, that’s the guitarist for Queen. And in fact he wrote a, he wrote a song called New Horizons.

Adam Marshall: Uh, I don’t know if there’s a way, maybe you know, in post we can, we can, we can pull it up. But uh, you know, it w I listened to it what the kids the other day and it’s actually pretty neat, but Brian May, my understanding is that later he went back and he was a hard science major in college, but went back, got his phd and I don’t know what, what, what he’s the investigator on what particular experiment. But, uh, he, he wrote a song called New Horizons. I see. I see. I don’t see a, like a very good link to it, but then very, uh, right next to it is the flyby. Uh, I think, I think it has the fly by or the photos set to the Brian May song. No, there’s an official Brian May website or a queen or something like that. One of his official sites that is put it out and it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s got, you know, certain Matt and animation graphics. So, uh, I just, I think that’s hilarious that, um, yeah, it’s the same guy. Yeah. It’s absolutely the same guy. And, and you know how you always had that big poofed big hair. It’s all gray and, but it’s still poofed man. Oof. So boom. That’s crazy. All right. Who’s turn is it? Probably, uh, I probably Adam’s prior, probably Brian May’s. Brian May. It’s your turn. This is ground control to Adam Marcello. Oh Man. Fuck into June.

Eric Chupp: That, that’s youtube

Marshall Morris: No, this is a, this is a game changing. This is the game game. Cas. Game Changer.

Adam Marshall: But yeah, no, so I mean this starting with China, it’s starting to feel a little bit but like a space race and we could find ourselves behind pretty quick. But I, I still think private enterprise in America has got in the United States has a lot to add public private partnership, right? Yeah, absolutely. Shit with a massive amount of money we have in the government. Let’s give people competing with each other. Marshall. Yeah, I

Adam Marshall: With every executive administration, every president of the changes, we get new priorities. I mean it really is going to take a private company that says, you know, a few years ago like Elan Musk said, I want to retire on Mars. Some bitch might do it. I mean he’s crazy. He’s thinking about all the technology. So we’re going to have to get around with electricity. We’re going to have to probably go underneath the surface of Mars. I mean all these, all these companies

Adam Marshall: and we might need flame throwers, right? Doing all of that shit. No. What’s underground mrs you may need a flame thrower. He saying is motherfuckers Trevor’s yes. Also saw ghost to Mars bitches with ice cube. Oh Man. Hell yes. Ice Cube. I think I saw an interview one time with ice cube and he got shit and he said, you know, yeah, it was around the time that he has around the time the barbershop was going on was like, no, my barbershop is like dad at home. I’ll go back to over the barbershop. Everybody’s cool once I get in the chair, man, I ain’t no different than anybody else. My brother would be like, why the fuck you make goes to marsh? Which was a shitty movie. But you know, there was a while when like everybody did a Mars movie, you know, I think Cameron did you know, I don’t know.

Adam Marshall: There was, there was a couple of them. What was the movie Avatar? No, no, the Martian was lard ass one s that’s as much of a triumph for, you know, fictional engineering. Ooh, who’s banging the table? I don’t know. We just had a jingle, jingle, jingle jangle. So anyway, but yeah, that was a great movie. I mean, it’s like you can’t ever do a sequel to it, but my kids love it because I got one kid that just loves to build shit in once, thinks he wants to be an engineer and I’m all for that. And he’s just like, I love that movie. You know? Is this like satiating some of your appetite for that? It started all of this whole idea was Adam when I talking about doing a podcast called B two p two ah, I remember that. Bring out before I even knew you had been in the, this, this side is saying, oh yeah, no, this, we

Adam Marshall: We have to have like a [inaudible] special. But I’m, I’m slowly kind of in the, in the, in the camp that we might not, we may need to reconsider our classifications. I mean, any, we’re classifying species we do. So we this or that. And if you’re drunk or not drunk, if you don’t fit certainty in one or the other, we either need a treat you as really special or get away. Yeah. You know, I mean the sacred or the profane were classifiers. And so class of classification systems always start simply and then they branch more. And so what is a planet? Um, that’s a question that’s above my pay grade, but I’m kind of at the point where, you know, do we just give them all playing a set us? Cause we found so many Kuyper belt objects that actually around that have and shit. In fact one of the dwarf planets when we said, okay now we got dwarf planets that came in was a little asteroid inner asteroid belt object that we actually visited with the vest or probe a couple of years ago called series and series is really interesting.

Adam Marshall: It looks like a tiny planet. It is. Basically it’s a dwarf planet, but it’s a dwarf planet that’s not out with Pluto. Cause I’ll by Pluto you’ve got these weird ones like quiet war and make make and again they sit up, right? No, no, not at all. You get out there, you’ve got these, these, these, these other planets dwarf planets that are out there. But then you’ve got this one in the inner asteroid belt between Mars and Jupiter called, uh, called a series. And series is round. It’s got an atmosphere. It’s got this big white patch on it. We’re trying to figure out, but we’ve got to, there’s actually the, the, the vest, a probe, I think he’s actually circling. Siri still went into orbit. Yeah. And so you’ve got a place that’s potentially ripe for exploration there. And so, so if we in, and honestly when you look at it, if we’re going to let Pluto is a planet where might as well lead series in is when we’re of, so we just have more, oh, I don’t need you.

Adam Marshall: We need to build a wall. Ooh, we got again. Oh yeah. So he needs you to him from coming off of, into the light and solar system wall at the edge of the solar system to keep these Kuyper belt motherfuckers from coming in and taking all of it. Yeah, I know. But you know, there’s some other word things about Pluto that are like, uh, you’ve got kind of the solar system plane, which, which most of the planets are kind of on a plane and they’re mostly circular orbits. Pluto’s orbit is irregular elliptical. It’s, it’s, it’s at a, it’s cockeyed to the solar system plane. So there’s some things that make it like, not one of us, the regular ones. So, but I don’t think he’d find it as irregular. I don’t know. I don’t know what, I’m not the classifier or an anti anti-flu tight. Not at all. All right. Our glasses are empty. All right. That was good.


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